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Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 24 2010, 03:13 PM

PRESS RELEASE

Available on July 31st, the Jaguar 64-Bit Preservation Pack will be limited to an initial run of only 100 copies and will receive a simultaneous launch both online and at the B&C Computervisions booth at CGE2K10.

The beta preservation pack includes the previously unavailable final build of Tiny Toon Adventures on cartridge, plus an autoboot CD with the following features:

+cdMENU: Transfers Roms Directly from CD-ROM to skunkboard from an easy-to-use menu.
+Several early builds of Tiny Toon Adventures, plus the only known beta of "Hollywood Hijinks" demo
+Betas of 3 other games, some of which date before the launch of the system. They contain obvious differences from the release versions
+View HTML manuals that contain additional developer notes, resources, and a comprehensive comparison against the retail release (where applicable)
+A duplicate of the original TT 030 development drive the ROMS were derived from. It is also packed with early development material

The Jaguar 64-Bit Preservation Pack is packaged in the same clamshell used for Mad Bodies and contains an instruction sheet, a high quality full-color insert, a cartridge and a professionally printed CD.

PURCHASE ONLINE: On the 31st we will be revealing an email address for order submissions. We will respond to submissions with a paypal address until we sell out. No order limit. The cost is $80 + Shipping.
>USA: $10 Shipping
>OTHER: $15 Shipping (differs in certain cases)

PURCHASE AT CGE: The first 25 are available at the B&C computervisions booth for $80

---------------------------------------------------------------
Released by Buddybuddies and Willard with huge thanks to:

Tursi: Compiled Roms, Permission to use Skunkboard drivers and logo, provided other extensive help
Belboz: Programmed autoboot CD and ROM Transfer Menu
B&C (Bruce): Produced the cartridges
AtariFan49 (Glenn): For selling dumping the TT030

Special thanks to Atariboy2600, Jaysmith2000, Gusbucket13, and the Tiny Toons Image Gallery Website for previously contributing other related and valuable resources. *Extended credits on disc.

JAGUAR RULES!

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 24 2010, 03:29 PM

This is awesome!

Posted by: LynxGod Jul 24 2010, 03:40 PM

Count me in, will be great to have this for Jagfest UK

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 24 2010, 03:46 PM

WOW!!!!!!! - This is Awesome news!!! I really like the sound of this, it's totally neat! -count me in for TWO copies! Pretty Please!!!!!!!!

Thank You Team Jaguar!

Edit: Dudes!, I just had a look at the pictures above - this shit rocks!, we're finally getting Tiny Toons on cartridge!!!!!! YAAAAA!


BB, Willard, Bruce, Glenn & Tursi & Belboz have really done something nice and different here! I am VERY VERY impressed with this.

Posted by: J-Man Jul 24 2010, 03:59 PM

Can't wait to get our copy at CGE!!! Now if only buddies was there to sign it.

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 24 2010, 04:16 PM

I'm sorry this greatness needs a another post.

Tursi and Belboz: Dudes: we are so lucky to have you both in the Jag scene here!!!, you guys are so technically inclined to come up with this. I really appreciate all the past and present efforts you both have put into the Jaguar for us. I also, think it's great that the two of you worked together on this. What a truely professional looking production this looks like, I'm just.... stunned,... this is really cool.

Thank you very much Willard & Buddies! for first making it even possible to do this for the community! -(nice one guys! -really, I know you guys didn't have to do anything)

Thank you Bruce & Glenn your contributions to this project and the Jaguar scene were just SUPER! -as they always have been.

Posted by: Jag_Slave Jul 24 2010, 04:30 PM

Nice- Im definitely signing up for this one

Posted by: Peter Jul 24 2010, 04:33 PM

This is looking really good. I also like the idea with the bootable CD, nice touch.
Does final mean that the game is finished?
Or is it just the last version of the game before development was stopped? How much of the actual gameplay is there?

Thank you very much. The community has been waiting a LONG time for that version of the game.
I think I even have two screenshots of it on the back of the Box of my Jaguar :-)

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 24 2010, 05:14 PM

Information on some of the content can be found here:

http://www.jaguarsector.com/index.php?showtopic=13361&hl=tiny+toons
http://www.jaguarsector.com/index.php?showtopic=31712

The final build is complete enough to show you how the entire game would have played (kind of like the Phase Zero Demo) but it is not a complete game. This is as far as they got before they restarted the game from scratch.

Early builds use the CG background from the back of the box and contain some other differences

Posted by: adolobe Jul 24 2010, 05:28 PM

Count me in on this ... god I hope i dont forget to order when the email address go live.

Really wish we could preorder =P

Posted by: Sigurd Jul 24 2010, 07:12 PM

Very cool!

Posted by: Tursi Jul 24 2010, 09:18 PM

Awesome release, and I am so glad to see this going out to the fans!

I don't feel I did that much here! I looked at the original files, determined what could be built, took a look at some of the code that wouldn't, and compiled carts for what I could get to run. Belboz deserves a lot more technical credit than I do!

Posted by: viMaster Jul 24 2010, 09:21 PM

I'll be picking up a couple from CGE hopefully. I guess that will be the first booth we visit

Posted by: Omf Jul 25 2010, 02:02 AM

im in on this one!

Posted by: Omf Jul 25 2010, 02:05 AM

just wondering, is the source included with this or is it just the compiled binaries?

Posted by: Alberto 2K Jul 25 2010, 04:13 AM

This is GREAT!!!

Count me in for one copy!!

Thanks Team Jaguar and all the people involved in this release, you´re awesome!!!!!

Posted by: Dan Iacovelli Jul 25 2010, 08:07 AM

I'm tempted to get that game for my collection.

Posted by: belboz Jul 25 2010, 08:07 AM

Couple notes on the cdmenu.

There are versions for Windows, OSX PPC, and OSX Intel

Only the Windows version will autoboot, and that depends on if you have autoboot enabled. Windows 7 disables autoboot. However for any of the above OS's, you can just run the menu program from CD if autorun doesn't work.

Thanks for all the kind words guys. I didn't have to do any major work to get the cdmenu working. Kudos should go to all the other guys who did all the real work!

Posted by: atarifan49 Jul 25 2010, 09:20 AM

Awesome work guys. That is a great way to get that treasure out to the community.

To those who ask. If the CD contains a complete archive of the TT030, then the source will be on there.

And for those who like to read the history as to why Tiny Toons never got released. You should look for the postings that contain the various notes from the producer who tried to salvage the project.

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 25 2010, 10:52 AM

I'm glad its pay day tomorrow!! Nice work guys!

Posted by: JSII Admin Jul 25 2010, 12:16 PM

Totally awesome release. So only 25 will be available at CGE? Hmmm....I guess I'll do one online and then one when I get down to CGE just to make sure I don't miss out! Awesome guys!

Posted by: EmOneGarand Jul 25 2010, 12:22 PM

Posted by: viMaster Jul 25 2010, 12:32 PM

Good point. I want two, so I should probably do the same. I'd be angry if we got down there and they were gone... well, and I guess I wouldn't want to take 2 when there are only 25 there at CGE.

I wonder if they'll be available online in the morning before we leave...

Posted by: Shaggy Jul 25 2010, 03:02 PM

I hate having no money right now

Posted by: JSII Admin Jul 25 2010, 03:48 PM

Good question, how soon will they be available on the 31st guys?

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 25 2010, 04:38 PM

Hmmm...I see now...Two copies too?, for you two, huh! - yeah me too!

This is just a really AWESOME release!

Posted by: atari_fan Jul 26 2010, 12:58 AM

Wow, I want one!



At which time on the 31st can orders be placed online? And where??

Posted by: Omf Jul 26 2010, 03:38 AM

yes, i want to know if i have to get up at 4am or not !

Posted by: DreamcastRIP Jul 26 2010, 06:22 AM

Great work and gratz to all involved.

Posted by: adolobe Jul 26 2010, 07:22 AM

Im buying this regardless as soon as the email ordes open up. But just out of curiosity how much of the game is playable?

Posted by: CD-i Jul 26 2010, 08:41 AM

From the Tiny Toons Thread:

There appear to be 5 levels. They can be summed up like this:
LVL1 (Dune): Complete
LVL2 (Cave): Complete, Only 1 Enemy
LVL3 (Dune2): The same as LVL1, new volcanic terrain color matches the level theme
LVL4 (Treetops): Empty
LVL5 (Mountainside): Empty

Posted by: hojbowski Jul 26 2010, 01:02 PM

This is great news! Thanks to all involved!

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 26 2010, 02:11 PM

CONCERNING REQUESTS FOR A TIME ON THIS RELEASE, IT WILL BE 12:00 AM EASTERN TIME

Here are some samples of the HTML manual that better describes the state of completion. Taken from the other thread, here are some notes on the rest of the game:

There appear to be 5 levels. They can be summed up like this:
LVL1 (Dune): Complete
LVL2 (Cave): Complete, Only 1 Enemy
LVL3 (Dune2): Remake of LVL1, new volcanic terrain color matches the level theme
LVL4 (Treetops): Empty - just some enemies walking around
LVL5 (Mountainside): Empty - Just some enemies walking around

Posted by: Omf Jul 26 2010, 03:15 PM

so i do have to get up at some ridiculous time in the morning then!

thanks for that

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 26 2010, 03:43 PM

Surely that's MIDDAY - get up you lazy bugger!!! I read that as 1700 BST Why would you release a game at midnight??

Posted by: Jag_Slave Jul 26 2010, 04:34 PM

Yeah I have no idea how to figure out the time zones. So I will just guess and cross my fingers

Posted by: Omf Jul 26 2010, 10:59 PM

are you sure, frog feast was the same, and that was a 4am job

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 26 2010, 11:33 PM

July 31st starts at midnight, of course, so that's correct Omf, midnight on July 30th-eastern US time(GMT -4) = 4:00 AM in Great Britian.

Here in Arizona, it's going to be 9:00PM on July 30th.

For Jagslave, it's going to be 10:00PM on July 30th(Kansas is central US time).

Posted by: atari_fan Jul 27 2010, 12:09 AM

I am not quite familiar with this timing info.

What does 12:00 AM mean? Is that midnight on July 30th? Or is it noon on July 31st?

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 27 2010, 01:25 AM

Usually your first thought about something is the correct one, as in this case.

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 27 2010, 02:55 AM

Sorry guys, but if you're really releasing this at midnight ET that's fucking ridiculous!! Surely a midday time would be better as 95% of your customers will be awake!!

Posted by: LynxGod Jul 27 2010, 03:34 AM

I totally agree

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 27 2010, 05:35 AM

So, is this midnight release of the information for real? I thought it was supposed to be simultaneous with the release during CGE?!

Posted by: adolobe Jul 27 2010, 06:16 AM

The time will never make anyone happy regardless of what you might think. There will always be someone somewhere who has an issue with it. Mid day to you might be crack of dawn to me or even worse could be while at work and you only have access to a local intranet with no way out.

It just goes to show how bad you really want the game to schedule for it in my opinion.

I'll actually be on a plain flying international during that time. . But that hasn't stopped me for setting up my wife with the details so she can order in my behalf. Just goes to show how bad you really want it

Posted by: CD-i Jul 27 2010, 06:43 AM

so i suppose thats 5 in the morning in germany? huh... seems like i have to get up early on weekend

Posted by: Alberto 2K Jul 27 2010, 07:36 AM

I think I will be asleep until that hour because I can´t assure I get up so early and with a few beers it´s done!!!

Posted by: Jag_Slave Jul 27 2010, 07:44 AM

Thanks Oval

Posted by: JSII Admin Jul 27 2010, 07:45 AM

I'll be just landing....Have to have the IPhone fired up!

Lady sitting next to me on plane: "Excuse me sir, what are you doing?"
Me: "Shut up lady, I'm trying to order Tiny Toons for the Jaguar"
Lady: "Is that a new car?"
Me: Shrugging....

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 27 2010, 07:57 AM

Posted by: ecwfan Jul 27 2010, 08:09 AM

Will the email address to order be posted in this thread on July 31 at midnight?

Posted by: Omf Jul 27 2010, 08:24 AM

i bet it wont be 4 am when you 'schedule' for your copy

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 27 2010, 08:25 AM

Actually you are wrong!! When we released AC94 (a much less desired game than this!) I still took into consideration the time in other parts of the world! The time 1800 BST would equate to 10 am in California, 1 pm ET USA, 7pm Central Europe. I thought at that point the only people who would be screwed by that time will be the Australians (2-4 am). Now there aren't too many Aussie jag owners (I know of 4!) So I thought this would be the fairest time for everyone. THAT is why a midnight time to me is ridiculous.

I would like a copy, but I am not getting up at stupid o'clock when I have a 20 hour shift later that day!

I would urge a re-think guys, move it 12 hours to midday & even the Aussies will still be up!

Posted by: adolobe Jul 27 2010, 09:52 AM

Im sure there will be a few copies left even the next day. I don't see a mad rush to order the 75 copies not at CGE that out number the few hardcore members on JSII and AA who would buy an uncompleted game at exactly 12am . It took Zaku months to sell its 300 copies at far less cheaper price and far larger user base system.

I do think there should be a limit however to 1 copy per person to help out those in difficult time zones, and to prevent those who would only purchase it to profit off later.

Posted by: adolobe Jul 27 2010, 09:56 AM

Actually it will pretty close if Ive not done my math wrong, I believe it will be 5am in London. My wife will be in London when the sell hits and I'll be on a flight to meet her there to visit her folks.

So we all must over come some difficulties.

Posted by: JSII Admin Jul 27 2010, 10:34 AM

I'll make the release time work no matter what, would be nice if it coincided with the opening of CGE, but whatever works. Hopefully 100 will be enough. I see these selling REALLY quick... Will more be made (unnumbered versions) or is this it?

Posted by: viMaster Jul 27 2010, 12:53 PM

Yeah, I'll make it work no matter what.

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 27 2010, 01:29 PM

We will be waiting for the email address eagerly.

Posted by: Jag_Slave Jul 27 2010, 04:32 PM

LOL Treck, for a second I thought you said "Angrily" instead of "Eagerly"...

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 27 2010, 06:01 PM

Nope. I want to get the game, not make the developer angry!

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 28 2010, 01:42 AM

Great release and i wouldnt mind picking one up even though im not really buying Jag games so much these days.
Do you plan to make a second run at some stage otherwise like someone said a limit of one per customer might be a good idea?

I just checked my shift roster and i wont be home until 3 hours after launch assuming its 5am london time.

Posted by: Gunstar Jul 28 2010, 06:39 AM

I've been away for a couple of weeks, and this is great news, but, while I understand that the sale of this game starts on July 31st at midnight, I can't seem to find in this very long thread what TIME ZONE is the midnight release in? So I can plan accordingly myself! HELP!

Posted by: atari_fan Jul 28 2010, 07:28 AM

They said "ET" which I believe stands for Eastern Time.

Posted by: Atari forever! Jul 28 2010, 11:09 AM

I've wanted "Tiny Toon Adventures" since I first saw the original Jaguar flyers and the pics on the Jaguar box. Too bad it's not complete

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 29 2010, 07:03 AM

UPDATE!!!!! At 12:00 PM (Noon) eastern time on the 31st "Team Jaguar" will be posting the email address here in this thread for you to submit orders for the Preservation Packs, thanks everyone for the comments and support!
Team Jaguar Rules!

Posted by: jonathan ascough Jul 29 2010, 07:11 AM

will be adding mine still miffed I lost out for aircars 94

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 29 2010, 07:15 AM

Great! Thank you!

Posted by: Omf Jul 29 2010, 07:19 AM

are you sure, send gaztee an email. as far as i am aware there is stock left!

Posted by: Omf Jul 29 2010, 07:20 AM

is this to reserve a copy or to send payment for the copies you want?

Posted by: Alberto 2K Jul 29 2010, 07:22 AM

Be prepared, orders are going to rain this Friday!!

Thanks Team Jaguar!

Posted by: jonathan ascough Jul 29 2010, 08:18 AM

I thought he was out but I only have enough money for one or the other, and i would rather tiny toons over Aircars no matter how good the box looks. The rest of my limited budget is going to the new prorotary I am working on

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 29 2010, 12:21 PM

To clarify, once the email address is revealed, we will be accepting order submissions. We will quickly respond to your email with a paypal address.

Once you get the paypal address you will have 1 day to pay before you are marked off the list and must RESUBMIT your order.

Concerning the "limited" release, for now we do not have any plans for a second run. However, if residual demand is substantial (for example, if we can only fill 1/3rd of our submissions) then we may reconsider. We have other projects to attend to and will wait and see how people respond to this before we make any decisions.

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 29 2010, 02:10 PM

Ok, I'll make sure I'm near a computer on July 31st at 12:00 Noon Eastern US Time!,.... 9am here in Arizona.

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 29 2010, 02:13 PM

I'm really glad that you changed the time, its much better for everyone in the Jag world!! Well except for me who will be stuck at work Oh well, good luck everyone!!!

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 29 2010, 02:51 PM

I will be sitting in front of my computer eagerly waiting for 12 Noon EST! Here's hoping sales go well!

Posted by: jonathan ascough Jul 29 2010, 03:10 PM

is it time yet

Posted by: crux Jul 29 2010, 03:21 PM

Seems I started poking around this forum at just the right time. This looks great. I will be pressing F5 incessantly come 11:59 on Saturday.

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 29 2010, 03:34 PM

Posted by: Serblander Jul 30 2010, 05:01 AM

Not me!

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 30 2010, 08:07 AM

Less than 24 hours to go....

Posted by: walter_J64bit Jul 30 2010, 03:14 PM

Good I live in the Eastern US Time zone!

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 30 2010, 04:53 PM

Wuss!! Past your bedtime is it old bean ;0)

Posted by: megasdkirby Jul 30 2010, 05:47 PM

I won't be able to get one since I will be working at that time.

There goes my chances.

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 30 2010, 09:47 PM

As soon as you get home jump on the computer and get the email addy from this thread and send it off. Wait,.. then check your inbox often. I would think there is a good chance you could still get one. How fast can 75 copies sell?

Posted by: adolobe Jul 30 2010, 09:51 PM

With multi copies being purchase some Jack Ass could buy 50 in one hit

Posted by: JSII Admin Jul 30 2010, 10:54 PM

I sure hope that doesn't happen. I don't want to miss out though, so one online and one at the show (if they still have them).....

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 31 2010, 12:06 AM

50 copies = about $4500.00 I doubt anything like that will remotely happen. As a matter of fact I'm willing to bet you'd be hard pressed to find any one person ordering 3 or more copies. I'm sure everybody including myself will have a good opportunity to buy a copy.

Posted by: adolobe Jul 31 2010, 12:45 AM

HAHA yea i sure hope someone doesn't but hell some ppl are hard core. See what the painter cart sold for one ebay a few months ago $200.. Im sure there are some lurkers just waiting at the opportunity to flip

I'll just have my email ready for my copy so all i have to do is copy past and send =P

Posted by: mawa Jul 31 2010, 01:47 AM

Hello i'm new here and a great atari jaguar collector in starting fase and i really want a copy off this game

but does somebody knows when sell start for the netherlands ( wich time ? )

thanx already

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 31 2010, 01:51 AM

The time difference should be +6 hours, so 1800 tonight!

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 31 2010, 01:52 AM

What no discount on postage?? Think I'll just stick to the 10 I'm planning to order if that's the case

Posted by: mawa Jul 31 2010, 01:57 AM

gaztee thanx for the quik answer
trying to build up a great collection and this one needs to be in my collection

Posted by: megasdkirby Jul 31 2010, 06:48 AM

I start at 12pm today, so perhaps right away when I start, I will take a 5 minute break to see if I can order a copy.

That is, if the website is not blocked.

I pray to be able to get a copy.

Posted by: adolobe Jul 31 2010, 07:55 AM

5min.. hope they are on time with posting that email addy =P

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 07:56 AM

Yeah i need to pee soon!

Posted by: adolobe Jul 31 2010, 07:58 AM

Then for your sake I hope they are on time. Kidney stones would be a bitch of a condolence prize

Posted by: Alberto 2K Jul 31 2010, 07:58 AM

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 07:59 AM

Yikes!

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 31 2010, 08:01 AM

The Jaguar 64-Bit Beta Preservation Pack (Tiny Toons Final + TT030 Drive Dump) is now available for sale!

Please email all order submissions to: TeamJaguarOrders@Yahoo.com and we will reply with a paypal address until we have sold out.

The following information must be included in your email:
(1) Your Paypal Address (so that we can match your payment with your email)
(2) Order Quantity
(3) Destination Country (for shipping purposes)

Once you get the paypal address you will have 1 day to pay before you are marked off the list and must RESUBMIT your order

The Cost is $80 + Shipping
>Shipping is $10 per cart in the USA
>Shipping is $15 per cart outside of the USA (May Differ in Certain Cases)

If it turns out that actual shipping costs substantially less than what you paid, we will refund a portion of the excess cost.

JAGUAR RULES!

IF YOU HAVE RECEIVED A CONFIRMATION RESPONSE WITH A PAYPAL ADDRESS YOUR CARTRIDGE IS RESERVED AND WE ARE STILL AWAITING PAYMENT IF YOU HAVE NOT PAID ALREADY

WE HAVE SOLD ALL Of THE CARTRIDGES THAT WE HAVE MADE UP! THERE WILL BE A SHORT DELAY UNTIL #75-100 ARE READY FOR SALE.

YOU CAN STILL EMAIL US TO RESERVE A COPY BUT WE WILL NOT RESPOND UNTIL WE HAVE MORE AVAILABLE TO SELL. IF THERE ARE ANY NON-PAYING BUYERS YOU MAY GET A RESPONSE ON MONDAY. IF EVERYBODY PAYS YOU MAY HAVE TO WAIT A WEEK OR TWO UNTIL THE LAST CARTS ARE BUILT.

THANKS AGAIN!

Posted by: adolobe Jul 31 2010, 08:02 AM

woohoo my email is sent

Now i wait for your reply =P

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 31 2010, 08:02 AM

Order Information posted in the new ORDER NOW thread to avoid the announcement getting lost in this thread. Thanks for your interest and support!

JAGUAR RULES!

Posted by: Omf Jul 31 2010, 08:02 AM

i am waiting !!!

Posted by: adolobe Jul 31 2010, 08:02 AM

New thread
http://www.jaguarsector.com/index.php?showtopic=31749&st=0&gopid=323369&#entry323369

order fast

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 08:03 AM

Sent.

Posted by: atari_fan Jul 31 2010, 08:03 AM

Email sent.

Posted by: Sargon Jul 31 2010, 08:04 AM

They threw us a curveball there!

Posted by: mawa Jul 31 2010, 08:04 AM

email have been sent

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 31 2010, 08:04 AM

E-mail sent!

Posted by: Isgoed Jul 31 2010, 08:06 AM

Email sent!

Posted by: bmX Jul 31 2010, 08:06 AM

email send!

Posted by: Omf Jul 31 2010, 08:06 AM

email sent, would have been nice to have been told a new thread was going to be created instead of leaning on F5 on the other thread

Posted by: Alberto 2K Jul 31 2010, 08:06 AM

Eamil sent a moment ago!!!

Posted by: mawa Jul 31 2010, 08:08 AM

I had the same probleem over here was hitting the f5 button all the time

Posted by: CD-i Jul 31 2010, 08:09 AM

email sent!

Posted by: LynxGod Jul 31 2010, 08:10 AM

email sent!!!!!

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 08:10 AM

I half expected it so stayed on the main forum page. This release is fun reminds me of when Gorf came out and the frenzy that entailed.

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 08:10 AM

Dude you sent it to me!

Posted by: LynxGod Jul 31 2010, 08:12 AM

Eh?

I used the email address above!

Posted by: bhodges080 Jul 31 2010, 08:13 AM

Has anyone gotten a response back yet?

Brian

Posted by: mawa Jul 31 2010, 08:13 AM

no not have a respond

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 08:14 AM

Got you worried though?

Posted by: tomwaits Jul 31 2010, 08:14 AM

Got my reply, and payment sent.

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 31 2010, 08:14 AM

My Beta Pack email request is sent!

Posted by: LynxGod Jul 31 2010, 08:15 AM

You utter bastard, I checked like 3 times

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 08:16 AM

sorry mate couldnt resist.

Posted by: atari_fan Jul 31 2010, 08:17 AM

LOL

Posted by: bhodges080 Jul 31 2010, 08:20 AM

Got my reponse and payment sent!

Brian

Posted by: maxx11111 Jul 31 2010, 08:21 AM

email sent

Posted by: Alberto 2K Jul 31 2010, 08:37 AM

I´ve just sent the payment!!

Posted by: Sargon Jul 31 2010, 08:37 AM

My payment has been sent. Even though I spent $90, it feels like I just won a contest!

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 31 2010, 08:38 AM

Hmmm...Bhodges got a reply and paid for it in 7 minutes, I'm going on a half hour now.... :/

Posted by: DrMalba Jul 31 2010, 08:40 AM

same here ...

[EDIT] Whoops.spoke too soon!

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 08:41 AM

Not had a reply yet.

Posted by: bhodges080 Jul 31 2010, 08:47 AM

It actually took around 15 minutes, I sent my email at 12:02

I'm pretty sure that if they were sold out they would have posted.

Brian

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 08:52 AM

Mmm strange, checked my sent folder and it went off at 17:03 but still no reply, didnt buy 90 copied or something did you?

Posted by: CHR_AeON Jul 31 2010, 08:55 AM

Same here, sent mine at 18:01 (GMT+01), but haven't received a reply, yet...

Posted by: mawa Jul 31 2010, 08:56 AM

I had sent it on 12.01 ET and also still not have the mail only have buy 1 copy for my collection


when its sold out they will post here i hope

Posted by: atari_fan Jul 31 2010, 09:00 AM

Payment sent for my Tiny Toon!

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 09:02 AM

Oh well off to work, hope you all got one ok, hope i have too!

Posted by: CHR_AeON Jul 31 2010, 09:16 AM

Just received a reply, payment sent

Posted by: LynxGod Jul 31 2010, 09:17 AM

Paid for

Posted by: mawa Jul 31 2010, 09:18 AM

Just recieve the mail

And already have pay for the item

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 31 2010, 09:20 AM

Emails received, Payment sent, all set to Rock!

Posted by: walter_J64bit Jul 31 2010, 09:25 AM

E mail sent

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 31 2010, 09:28 AM

We have caught up to all order submissions. If you have received an email from us and paid your order should be secured.

It may take us a short while (an hour or two) to respond to future submissions.

WE WILL POST A NOTIFICATION ONCE ALL COPIES HAVE BEEN SOLD.

Thanks to all for the interest and support!

Posted by: maxx11111 Jul 31 2010, 09:41 AM

hmm me not got a reply

Posted by: evisu Jul 31 2010, 10:20 AM

email sent

Posted by: JSII Admin Jul 31 2010, 11:01 AM

These are going to run out fast! I was FIRST IN LINE at the B&C booth to snag this! Going to go play it now.

Posted by: TrekMD Jul 31 2010, 11:34 AM

Payment sent!

Posted by: jonathan ascough Jul 31 2010, 12:26 PM

payment sent too

Posted by: dubchaser Jul 31 2010, 12:34 PM

Email sent for paypal email.

Posted by: evisu Jul 31 2010, 12:39 PM

The money is on the way.

Posted by: Gaztee Jul 31 2010, 12:43 PM

Nice to see that some things don't change eh??

Posted by: maxx11111 Jul 31 2010, 12:55 PM

payment sent yay

Posted by: blackmaiden Jul 31 2010, 01:18 PM

E-mail recieved and payment has been sent. Just a case of the waiting game now. And i hate waiting Lol.

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 31 2010, 01:31 PM

IF YOU HAVE RECEIVED A CONFIRMATION RESPONSE WITH A PAYPAL ADDRESS YOUR CARTRIDGE IS RESERVED AND WE ARE STILL AWAITING PAYMENT IF YOU HAVE NOT PAID ALREADY

WE HAVE SOLD ALL Of THE CARTRIDGES THAT WE HAVE MADE UP! THERE WILL BE A SHORT DELAY UNTIL #75-100 ARE READY FOR SALE.

YOU CAN STILL EMAIL US TO RESERVE A COPY BUT WE WILL NOT RESPOND UNTIL WE HAVE MORE AVAILABLE TO SELL. IF THERE ARE ANY NON-PAYING BUYERS YOU MAY GET A RESPONSE ON MONDAY. IF EVERYBODY PAYS YOU MAY HAVE TO WAIT A WEEK OR TWO UNTIL THE LAST CARTS ARE BUILD.

THANKS AGAIN!

JAGUAR RULES

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 31 2010, 01:37 PM

Wow!- You guys went through 75 copies like cool, fresh water in Arid-zona. Congratulations on a successful business endeavor. Thanks Again, for this release, Team Jaguar!

Posted by: megasdkirby Jul 31 2010, 01:59 PM

Now I am scared.

I just arrived home and noticed that I was successfull in sending an email during my work shift. I got an email back saying the following:

"Your order submission has been successful"

It also contained the email address to where to send payment.

But after reading your post, does this mean that I lost out? Wasn't a copy be reserved for at least 24 hours or something? Is my copy still reserved?

I want to know so I can send payment ASAP (right now, in fact).

Please let me know when possible.

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 31 2010, 02:09 PM

If you received a confirmation response with a paypal address your cartridge is reserved. That message is for people who did not receive a confirmation message.

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 31 2010, 02:20 PM

Now we'll be spending the whole week shipping out boxes and filling out customs forms

Very happy with the way this turned out, we are currently working on several other projects that we'd like to get out by the end of the year, so getting this out the door will really untie some funds and help us focus on these other projects

Playing the TTA demo probably won't compare to the significance of finally having the last build available and on cart, but it's a nice solid demo and there are plenty of extras on the CD, let us know what you guys think of it!

JAGUAR RULES!

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 02:43 PM

How comes i sent my email before a couple of others here but havnt had an email back?

Posted by: Team Jaguar Jul 31 2010, 02:50 PM

If you have not received a response from us we likely have not recognized your order. For those with similar issues please PM us directly with the name used for your email and your paypal address and we double-check our forms.

thanks,
Team Jaguar

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 03:05 PM

Tiny Toons you little beauty .

bunny fetish

Posted by: Jag_Slave Jul 31 2010, 04:45 PM

Email Sent

Posted by: megasdkirby Jul 31 2010, 05:52 PM

Just sent payment!

I am so happy I was successful in purchasing a copy!

Posted by: CD-i Jul 31 2010, 06:32 PM

payment has been sent!

Thanks

Posted by: JagMod Jul 31 2010, 07:22 PM

I haven't seen Jay for over two years, and we he comes through the doors at the show the only thing he says to me is "WHERE IS THE B&C BOOTH?

Thanks guys, I got my copy, new jag stuff is always welcome.

Posted by: goatdan Jul 31 2010, 08:04 PM

Oh damn it all, I thought that 12am meant 12am, not noon. I was confused when it didn't go up last night, and then I just stopped back now to find out they are all sold out.

Anyone want to pick me up a copy at CGE? It's rare that I care about betas, but this was one that I had been really interested in getting...

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 31 2010, 09:19 PM

Send your request now to: TeamJaguarOrders@Yahoo.com NOW! as there are 25 of those 100 copies still left to sell in a few weeks I am told. Yes, the time was Midnight! but was changed to high Noon Eastern time on the 31st. The 25 at CGE are gone, I think?

Posted by: goatdan Jul 31 2010, 09:59 PM

I'm confused on if the main page is saying everything is accounted for except the CGE carts or not.

Also, what is it with the Jaguar community and doing limited editions of stuff? It's really made me stop collecting a lot of Jaguar stuff in the last couple years, because I'm not always able to scramble together the money at the exact time that stuff comes out, and when I miss out on stuff I'm not going to pay a bazillion dollars on the secondary market for stuff. Why not do like Battlesphere did and open up preorders for a period of time, take deposits and then make whatever there is demand for? It would be WAY easier to come up with $80 if I had a month to do it in, and I would feel a lot less stupid about paying secondary market mark up prices if I knew I missed a full month of preorder time.

Doing this would definitely result in more of my money going to more Jaguar stuff and the people who find it or create it than it does now. If I can't get Tiny Toons because I didn't read whatever post it was that changed the release time of it, it means I keep $80 and probably will never see the game. The people who put the time into finding it get nothing. I just don't get it. Sorry for the mini-rant, but it's something that I definitely wish was done differently.

Make an LE if you like, I'm definitely not opposed to that, but then make the standard Tiny Toon cart available as a non-LE thing so that people have the opportunity to see the work. Please.

Posted by: ovalbugmann Jul 31 2010, 10:22 PM

Ok, so I take it that him saying; "we have sold ALL of the cartridges that we have made up" as meaning the 25 CGE carts as well as the 50 online order carts too.

So the 25 remaining are open to people still, I would just send a request for one now and start gathering the funds up. It says you may have up to 2 weeks before they are ready- giving you more time.

Yeah, they changed the time from 12AM to 12PM on the 31st, but the start of the 31st would be midnight on the 30th, not midnight Eastern time on the 31st as you are first posting now at around 9PM tonight ?-right! So it looks as if you overshot the original start time/date by a full day? - which if you first replyed at this time yeserday you could have caught the time change post. Don't worry, you still have a good chance of getting one and they also said that if it warrants it they will do another run of this release - so don't fret or be upset just yet...

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 11:00 PM

Just sent my payment, I never did get the email put thankfully Willard had got my details ok and sent me the payment address via PM . Did the email say anything other than payment address?

Posted by: atari_fan Jul 31 2010, 11:09 PM

It also said, that payments should be made within 24 hours after receiving the paypal address.

So I guess, you´re fine.

Posted by: Bonzo Jul 31 2010, 11:14 PM

Ok thanks.

Posted by: Gusbucket13 Aug 1 2010, 09:59 AM

Phew 19 hours, cutting it a bit fine but made it. Dosh sent. Thanks guys for being as good as your word.

GB13

Posted by: TrekMD Aug 1 2010, 10:27 AM

Those went fast!

Posted by: J-Man Aug 1 2010, 10:52 AM

We clearly missed you Scott.

Posted by: Astropuff Aug 1 2010, 01:22 PM

I think I missed out I hope you do another run that would be great

Posted by: megasdkirby Aug 1 2010, 01:52 PM

I agree. There has been games I recently heard about for the Jaguar that would love to get, but those same games now reach multiple times the amount that it used to cost originally. I know desperation is a key factor for paying bucketloads of cash for an item, but alot of this could be easily rectified by making second releases and such. An example was Painter for the Jaguar. I really wanted a copy when I heard about it, then I saw the first one on Ebay (the first one I ever saw) go for around $125 or so. This shocked me as odd, as I never expected a homebrew go more than it's original asking price. Then I saw another one sell for an insane $250 or so, which threw me off from getting one. A second release of the game will grant other members a chance to play a great game, though it will kill the current price of the game. I know it's taboo for collector's, but I rather have many enjoy a great game by releasing subsequent copies of the game than to only have a few copies of the game and still prohibit those same people who want to play the game because of the high price the item can fetch. I understand that copies will be limited, since the cost of creating these games can be a tad high due to materials, but...



...with the advice given by goatdan, a good amount of copies can be made by all who wanted the game. Also, it limits the game to a few per customer, preventing widespread resales at extremely high prices. One copy per customer should be enough to satisfy many gamer needs, as there is a higher possibility that more folk will be able to get a copy. Also, if there were, say, 83 people who preordered the game, the creator can make at least 100 copies, because even after the initial 83 sold, it is guaranteed that the other 17 will sell as well. And if the 100 copies sell relatively quickly, a second release will sell out fast as well. Though I understand that materials and time is a concern, though.



This is how I feel about Painter as well. I know many will consider me a heretic for wanting a second release (because it will loose it's value), but I know others would welcome a second release as well. And I know it will sell considerably well, specially after how much people were willing to spend on the last Painter copy.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a collector too. But I would love for others to enjoy the games released for it as games were meant for just that: to be enjoyed.

But I digress.

Going back to topic, I'm really looking forward to this release! It will be kick ass to get a copy of the game and see how it plays, it feels, it sounds...everything! It's going to be a good night of Jaguar play when this copy arrives at home!

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 1 2010, 02:14 PM

That's why we only did an initial run of 50 of the Aircars 94. Its harsh for people who came to the party late to have missed out. Granted AC94 was never going to be as popular at Tiny Toons, but we want everyone who wants to own the game a chance to get one. Not sure that will stop one going for silly money at some point on eBay, but we've tried our best!!

Team Jaguar seem to have quite a bit in the pipeline, so limiting runs makes sense? Maybe if there is still a demand when all is done, then things can be revisited??

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 1 2010, 02:20 PM

Well I'm trying to persuade OMF to do more painters. I believe that the original ones were individually numbered, so I believe that won't be happening again! We are looking at getting the box, manual etc done as per Aircars 94, so that will keep collectors happy as it will be different from the first run!!

I'll keep nagging him like the bitch I am for you bud

Posted by: blackmaiden Aug 1 2010, 02:30 PM

Thats it Gaztee you keep nagging him. Don't give up.

Posted by: JSII Admin Aug 1 2010, 03:45 PM

It's important to have priorities! It was great seeing you again bud!

Posted by: Sargon Aug 1 2010, 09:24 PM

I may have missed it, but I don't recall seeing that Tiny Toons was intended to be a "limited edition". The initial run was limited to 100, but I didn't see anything in the release to prevent them from creating additional copies according to demand.

In more general terms, I do agree with your limited edition concerns. I am not a fan of limiting a release just for the sake of making it a limited edition. While I am a collector, I still think the most important thing for the community is for games to be available to a broad population. It is unfortunate when one of the best games on a system (a la Battlesphere) is so extremely hard/expensive to come by. I am perfectly fine with someone creating a limited edition and following it up with a broader release, but I just don't agree with holding games back in order to preserve their value as limited releases. This is just my opinion, but ultimately the developers can do whatever they want!

Posted by: Gusbucket13 Aug 1 2010, 10:50 PM

I dont think people that do a cartridge release think for one moment about the investment potential of their product if they make it a limited edition, at least in my cases the end production figure was dictated simply by the amount of money I had available to buy the components and availability of those components.

Private releases like these will always be hamstrung by funding limitations.

Just my ten penneth worth anyway

GB13

Posted by: Peter Aug 2 2010, 01:40 AM

While I never released anything I can imagine that this would be the biggest limitation and maybe space or headaches to have something constantly on stock...


BTW Haven't read anything from you in a long time I think. Good to see you back Gusbucket

Posted by: Omf Aug 2 2010, 03:48 AM

stock of cartridges is something that one doesn't want, it is cost that is very hard to claim back especially when the chips are soldered into the boards.

if 100 are made and 50 are sold, you still have a high cost of potentially useless items to sit on. this is not only depressing but expensive. it is my view only to make what is required. stock in my opinion is foolish, especially when personally funded!

Posted by: CD-i Aug 2 2010, 04:12 AM

so thats why i'd love to see a pre order timeframe. everyone has the chance zu reserve a copy and the maker have a list of their total cost and can make the number of carts which is needed.

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 2 2010, 05:18 AM

Surely that's what eBay is for??? People outside the community suddenly seeing something new & paying stupid money for it!!
At least with the tiny toons release will free up team jaguar to release their next projects!!

Posted by: goatdan Aug 2 2010, 09:15 AM

Actually, I was here on the morning of the 30th wondering what was going on. After seeing that it wasn't released, I thought they meant that it would be 11:59pm on the 31st. Regardless, it wouldn't tick me off nearly as much if I could just get the stupid Tiny Toons cart. Now, if I don't get it, I'll never get to see it, which for something like this that I've always wondered what it would look like is a strange, poor decision - especially when the release information changes last minute.

Posted by: adolobe Aug 2 2010, 09:18 AM

They actually changed the release time a few days before the deadline. Mainly due to people being out raged at it being so late in there time zones.

There are still 25 left for sure and who knows how many people requested and didnt pay for it. Just send them an email and when they put the last remaining 25 together you might be able to snag one.

Posted by: goatdan Aug 2 2010, 09:31 AM

I love Painter, Amidar for the 2600 is one of my favorite 2600 games, and the gameplay is totally fun. I missed the original release. I have no intention of paying a bazillion dollars for a second-hand market copy of the game. I don't know how that one was handled, but I do believe it was limited...



Yes, but why was the initial run limited to 100 then?



Here's the thing with Battlesphere though -- Battlesphere was announced and pre-orders for it were taken for months. When the game was nearing production, as I recall the team made enough games to cover the pre-orders and a few more. Near the same time, a few high profile articles were released about the game that drove up demand tons for the game. Also, as I recall, Battlesphere LE was then released to try to help meet that demand too.

I have no issues with someone doing an LE of something and then releasing a full game (like what happened with Gorf). I also have no problem with what happened with Gorf and why it's value has increased so much because of that. But to limit things just for the sake of limiting things? I don't get it. It isn't like once the game sells, the developer gets the higher resale value.



So, if you had taken pre-orders for a month because the game was done, and then once you had all the money from everyone, you produced the cartridges and delivered in two more months, wouldn't that have solved this issue?

I mean, modern games do it -- you can reserve and pay for whatever you want at GameStop. I've done it with our Dreamcast releases, which are a different production beast, however the point is I have no issue with a developer getting money from me to make the games and deliver in a few months.



So again, do a pre-order thing. If you only get enough money to produce 25 of them, then you produce 25 of them and if / when the second hand market blows up, then *I* feel stupid for not having ordered it when I should have if I want it. Instead, when stuff like this gets artificially limited, I just stop caring about buying it. I haven't bought anything 'unofficial' for the Jaguar since the Fight For Life Beta that, as I remember, I got during a pre-order period a few years ago. When stuff gets limited, I just don't collect it and I instead spend my money on other things altogether.

What I'm saying is I would *rather support the people doing this stuff*, but a lot of recent stuff has been giving me *no way to do so*. Buying on the second hand market does not support the original developer, or the people that did the work to find the work of other developers and put them on carts.

Posted by: Team Jaguar Aug 2 2010, 11:30 AM

Everybody who reserved their copy did pay on time. A few people did make mistakes (such as paying in GBP instead of USD) so we will be contacting a few people shortly to resolve these issues. Nobody should be getting a response for a little while until the last 25 are made. A notification will be posted when these are complete just as a heads up.

Concerning the limited release, as noted, we have several other projects to attend to and we think it's important to get all of them out there. A second run of TTA would probably take at least a year to sell and this would tie up our funds and hinder progress on other projects. We will revisit Tiny Toons if there is sufficient demand once we get a chance.

Since few people actually share Jaguar sales figures we had no idea what to expect- and we are honestly a bit overwhelmed atm as we did not think we would sell out so quickly. We may try other alternative release ideas in the future (such as preorders), but tbh it appears we announced this a little too early and probably would have had to postpone the release at least two months if we had taken preorders and wanted to satisfy 100% of the demand on day 1.

Posted by: Gusbucket13 Aug 2 2010, 12:24 PM

I would say if we all lived in an ideal world where everything ran on time and no one ever cocked-up then pre orders would be the way to go, but alas we do not live in an ideal world and trying the pre-order route invariably bites the developer in the bum.

1001 unanticipated things can delay a release, from printers messing up the boxes to familly emergencies every one of the many aspects of a release has to come together just so. You name it - if it can happen it most probably will happen in this VERY imperfect world. When this delay occours folks who have parted with money up front rapidly get indignant and impatient which makes for an unhappy experience for all concerned.

I believe this release has been handled efficiently and smoothly given the limitations of private individuals having R/L commitments. Kudos guys

GB13

Posted by: Gunstar Aug 2 2010, 12:36 PM

At first I was reletively excited about this release, as many have said, it was supposed to be one of the early Jaguar releases, but never made it, and over the years of development and beyond there were a lot of rumors about the existance of one of the versions of this game be finished or nearly so. I and many others have been extremely curious over this (and all lost Jag titles) for years, so naturally I was a bit excited becuase it's something "new" for the Jag. I too, had a problem with understanding what time the game would go on sale in my time zone, I asked but I haven't looked for a response becuase I lost my internet connectivity over the past weekend and I missed out on it anyway. But now that the whole sale has pretty much come and gone, I'm glad I didn't get a chance to buy it. The fact is, I haven't been a big platformer fan for years, and this one probably would have gotten little play by me (I'm not 100% on this of course) anyway. This isn't the first or last "new" Jag game I've passed on anyway. I passed on Mad Bodies becuase I tried it years ago at a show and I wasn't impressed with the game play then, just not my thing. I passed on Total Carnage (even though it's still available) for the same reason; not my type of game. Years ago the same was true for Soccer Kid and Painter. So it's just not a big deal to me anymore if I don't get to try Tiny Toons. But, isn't there another way...

@ Team Jaguar

After this limited run, with all it's goodies and collectability, if you guys are looking to move one to other projects (which I'm all for, hopefully the next game will be more to my liking). why not sell the rom image online to those of us who have Skunkboards, etc.? More people get to check it out, but don't have to pay so much, and you guys don't have to worry about making more when you want to move on. I'm not saying just becuase the Skunkboard exists that every developer should be releasing games for it, but that was one of the main points for the skunkboards release (along with development purposes): for cheaper and wider spread release of Jag software. Keep the cartridges coming, and CD releases too, with box, manual, the whole nine yards, I'll by the ones that interest me enough and that are released when I have money and time, but why not a parallel or later release of just the rom and iso images? If it's a piracy issue, the Skunkboard supposedly has a solution to check if it's a registered rom image or not. As for the CD side of software, well, the discs you sell can be just as easily pirated as an iso image anyway, these days...

Posted by: JagMod Aug 2 2010, 01:16 PM

ok, cross off Tiny Toons as having a screenshot on the jaguar box and never released.
What are the others? Its been too long since I looked at the back of the box.

Posted by: evisu Aug 2 2010, 01:58 PM

That´s what i wrote at Planet Atari I can´t imagine that i will play TT soon. As i have seen the screenshot at the box i thought: "F*** the SNES of my buddy. Soon i have my own (much better) TT" Hahaha, only 15 or 16 years later the dream comes true

Posted by: megasdkirby Aug 2 2010, 03:05 PM

With both being excellent examples, it makes me wonder: why don't they (the original parties responsible) re-release the games again? Let's focus on Battlesphere for a bit: a re-release would definitely sell VERY well because there are many of us who want a copy. Sure, on the other hand, a group of collectors will bust a nut if a re-release is done, because that implies that their copy will drastically loose value. For me, it doesn't really matter because many others will get to play an excellent game that was once out of their reach if a second release is created. Also, the company or people responsible for creating the copies will make a good chunk of cash in the process, and we all want money!



Exactly! And the company or people responsible can create extra copies that WILL sell, specially on Ebay. Not trying to say to make 500 copies of a game, but if the original run was, say, 100 copies, create another 50 to sell on Ebay. It is guaranteed to sell...specially on the 'Bay!

Posted by: Sargon Aug 2 2010, 03:27 PM

Even though I recently shelled out a large amount of money for Battlesphere Gold, I do agree that a re-release would be very profitable and a good thing for the Jaguar community. The only problem with the pre-order model is that there is always going to be someone who "just missed" it. Maybe they were away for a few weeks or simply are new to the Jaguar, but then the cycle starts again. There is no perfect solution, but as long as there is enough demand for a game I don't see any reason to hold it back. I'm not the one releasing games though and I'm sure there is a lot of work that goes into a successful release.

Posted by: goatdan Aug 2 2010, 08:10 PM

I understand the idea of having other projects to attend to, but even if I do end up being one of those 25 other people (if I'm not writing myself out by being critical on here), I doubt that I'll care to even both trying for those. The demand for a new run of Tiny Toons probably won't be enough to warrant another run, which means that I'm out of luck and will probably never get to play this game.

Besides that, this game was first "revealed" on the back of the Jaguar in 1993. If it had taken a couple more months to come out, but I would have had a shot at getting a copy where I didn't have to re-read the thread every couple days to see if things had changed, I would be really happy right now. It isn't like in two months, Jaguar fans are going to give up on Tiny Toons (or *any* release) and move on.



Coming from a guy who has released five Dreamcast titles that have sold more copies than probably every post-mortem Jaguar release combined, including three that hit on delays (including a MAJOR year long delay for two of them), you set a date and leave time for yourself to ensure you have everything. If it doesn't come together in time, you explain the reason and offer people their money back. Again, I've been wanting to play this game since I first saw the Jaguar (in 1995 for me), if I get my hands on a copy in a year, I'd be happy. Instead, I *will not get a copy of this game* because I *did not go fast enough*.

I would bet that no one would freak out and demand their money back for a even a six month-long delay, as long as the reasons were given and people knew the games were coming. Instead, the likelihood that I'll randomly run into a Jaguar fan that has this game is basically zero, so my delay in getting it will be *forever*.

If people in the Jaguar community really freak out about a small release being delayed a few days, then this place has bigger issues. And maybe it does -- I VERY clearly remember people from this community writing emails to me that compared me to Hitler (and they were being serious), emails telling me that they wished I would die, emails telling me that me hosting Jagfest 2K1 was the worst thing that could have happened to the scene, etc... after I offered to host Jagfest 2K2 in Milwaukee. I offered because I really enjoyed the console and (I thought) the people involved, and I thought that after having a really successful year when we were the only people to volunteer to host that people might like to have some stability to the event.

It all turned out well enough with us going on to create the Midwest Gaming Classic (and, ironically, being the only US place where you can find a Jagfest event now), but if someone is still going to freak out in this community and be so damn childish about it today, why doesn't the community kick out people like that? After the 2001 event, a TON of long-time Jaguar fans left the community. Names that I know that few will remember on these boards, like Fard and Micah. Why does the Jaguar community of all places weed out the good people and protect the idiots?

In my stops back here it had always seemed like it had gotten better. I still don't stop back that often because I still have a very negative view of a lot of the garbage that I went through in 2001/2002, but I did think most of the people here were not the same morons I had to deal with. I guess if this is the concern from a developer, that I'm wrong. And if that is the case, again -- why doesn't the community do what a lot of the other communities do and weed out the bad eggs? Pardon me for standing on the soap box here, but the Jaguar doesn't exactly have enough fans for there to be a ton of in-fighting -- and if you can't understand why developers might delay something, you should really be out of video games altogether, as it happens to 360 and PS3 games every day too.

Sorry, down from the soap box, but I thought this community had at least partially moved beyond this crap.



I think with Battlesphere, and I'm sure that someone can correct me if I'm wrong, the original version they did they had to promise Hasbro to give 100% of the money made from it to charity to get Hasbro to release the Jaguar into the public domain. Battlesphere Gold was created because it was excluded from that original release, but as I recall part of the thing with it was that it was promised that it would be limited to only whatever they were going to release and not be re-ran. I don't know if I'm remembering all the details right, but again -- there was a HUGE pre-release period where they got you to sign up for emails, emailed you to offer you a slot, took pre-orders, made and delivered those and so on. If you were into the Jaguar at that time, you had a LOT of time to sign up for your copy. If you weren't and you came later, I have no issues that the game is overpriced now, as it's reputation precedes it.

It's the same as a game like Earthbound. I bought my complete boxed copy for $5.99 after it came out. Since then, people have discovered the game and loved it, and that has driven prices into the stratosphere. But *everyone* who wanted to buy it back in the day had a chance to get it...



Well, like I said above, if there is a pre-order model that is set up to realistically capture enough interest from the current community, then I have NO issues with it. If I had missed this for two months because I was super busy or didn't have the money and couldn't get it together, if everyone else who wanted a copy had one, I could feel that realistically soon, someone else would sell their copy and I could snag it -- maybe for the same $80ish price that they paid. But, since demand is higher than the copies made, my option is going to be to pay $200-god-knows-what on the second hand market or not EVER see the game. Of which, since I think that limited editions without a wide release are stupid, I'll pick the second one every time.

Again, sorry -- but this was something that I was actually quite excited about, and knowing that because I did not see the last minute change of the release time, I missed the less than 12 hour window to purchase the game and will probably never have a chance to even *play* it now, it's extremely disappointing. I'm glad so many others are happy that they got their copies, and if you ever decide to sell one for the price you paid to someone who just wants to play the damn game (or borrow me your Tiny Toons cart for a week, I don't have a Skunkboard so the rest is useless to me), I'd be very grateful.

Posted by: Tursi Aug 2 2010, 09:55 PM

There are numerous ways for NEW software to check against the Skunkboard. There's no way for new OLD software to be protected without rewriting it.

Posted by: atarifan49 Aug 2 2010, 10:30 PM

Here is a picture of the B&C booth at opening of CGE2K10. Lots of people there to grab a copy of Tiny Toons. I had to grab a picture of this.

Posted by: Isgoed Aug 2 2010, 10:54 PM

@ Goatdan

Ask for a copy of TT in the "wanted to buy" section.

There might be someone who purchased more then one copy, and would be willing to part with it?

Posted by: Team Jaguar Aug 2 2010, 11:23 PM

@dan, we aren't trying to leave anybody out, we just have to wait a little while until we get some time to gauge future demand. This print was scheduled for CGE2K10 and we thought 100 would last us. We have not contacted anybody concerning 76-100 yet and last I checked those who emailed us do have one reserved (but don't know it yet), so we think we were pretty accurate with out forecast. We opted not take pre-orders just due to the potential frustration delays can cause or unpaid orders can create. Perhaps this is an option to consider in the future.

Our next run may be as little as 25-50 just to accomodate those who were left out. We are not going to be making this continuously available and unfortunately some people will 'just miss' buying this no matter when we draw the deadline. If people are interested in a copy we encourage them to email the address (anytime) and we will factor that in and see how long it takes until we get a sufficient number.

We really are in a bind with resources and are simply trying not to spend time making cartridges that people don't want when we could be working on another project. We also want to see how people respond to the 100 we already made, and see if another run is warranted. We are doing the best that we can right now and we do have other things to worry about, but we'll try to make sure everyone who followed this is covered- it just might take a little time

Posted by: ovalbugmann Aug 2 2010, 11:35 PM

Congratulations, Team Jaguar!!!! - I agree with GB13 in that the distribution of this release was handled efficiently and smoothly and professionally. I mean I really don't see how it could have been handled any better, they even catered to our overseas friends & buddies to change the release time. What more is needed!? Not everything goes perfectly, as some people received a return email very quickly and others had to wait much longer(myself) but I got my order in.



I don't think this is necessary right now, as nobody online has gotten their copy yet!, and there are 25 more copies to be sold in this run alone(2 weeks from now), with possibly another TT run down the road. As they say you can't please everyone ALL of the time and I can't really think of anything they could have done better other than to have all of those 75 online copies ready to be sold now, rather than 2 weeks from now, but that time will come soon enough. The person who had to solder all those carts up probably needed a little break.

Posted by: atari_fan Aug 3 2010, 12:09 AM

I agree with ovalbugman 100%. The sale was properly announced way ahead so everyone interested could get ready. The revised timing shows that Team Jaguar listened well to what "customers" wanted. I ordered a few minutes after start time and it took Team Jaguar just 5 minutes to respond so I made the payment a little bit later.

Now I am looking forward to getting TT.

Thanks again.

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 3 2010, 12:35 AM

I am sure OMF can vouch for that one!!

Posted by: goatdan Aug 3 2010, 06:38 AM

If you read every post on the board every day, you're absolutely right. I, even as of midnight on the 30th, was wondering what was going on. Like I said, I'm sure that everyone who gets one will agree that this was handled great. I just don't understand why pre-orders are not an option with this community.

If this is the way that everyone likes it, then that's great, but it doesn't expand the community at all when people who don't read the site every day do not even get a chance to order something. If the goal is to keep the Jaguar community with the same people and never grow, then this is the perfect way to accomplish that.

And seriously, everyone is freaking out about there maybe being a delay - let's call out who on these forums doesn't understand that stuff happens, as those people alone are hurting this community *the most* of anyone, and when any project takes pre-orders, tell people that the release date is tentative, and that delays may occur. If those people that can't wait an additional day to get a game that was first announced more or less 17 years ago, then those people can not order.

Posted by: megasdkirby Aug 3 2010, 01:12 PM

Perhaps it's fear that the game may not arrive in time. An example is "Pier Solar", that was announced for "release" I think over two years ago and it's STILL being tested, or at least pending release. I still say the game will be released on December 21 2012

Posted by: litoskin Aug 3 2010, 02:50 PM

i sent he email only now (i was in hospital for a chirurgical operation) i only hope there will be some carts left....

Posted by: goatdan Aug 3 2010, 03:11 PM

Then do what we have done with the GOAT Store Publishing releases -- don't announce a pre-order until the game is done being tested. Then, announce a pre-order that during that time you can get together all of the assets for the publishing of the title, and then close pre-orders, produce the game and deliver.

In fact, I'll put this out there right now -- we actually just announced that we are going to be relaunching GOAT Store Publishing's web site today -- if anyone is having issues making games because of money or wants to run a pre-order thing like this, I'll gladly handle that part of it for you with the GOAT Store and take 100% of the blame if there are any delays. You can contact me for details if anyone would like to.

Or, if you don't want us having a hand in it, I can help you set up how to run it and we can figure something out that works well and ensures you aren't on the hook. I have the experience of doing this multiple times already, and I would be more than happy to help people out. I really love the Jaguar, and just want to ensure that people that are fans can play all the awesome stuff out there.

Posted by: Team Jaguar Aug 3 2010, 05:09 PM

UPDATE: we just finished tallying orders for 75-100 and STILL HAVE SOME CARTS LEFT! Those who have reserved one will get one, some responses will be sent out soon others may take a little longer

Posted by: crux Aug 5 2010, 08:38 PM

I completely agree here. I only happened to join this site recently because I was doing some research on getting a second rotary controller. It just so happened I found out about these games being released at the same time. I'm an adamant supporter of small releases like this - I've purchased them for a myriad of different systems and a myriad of different developers, including several for Jaguar before now because of how active the after market scene is here. I think it's great that these communities can get together and find support for consoles that everyone else has forgotten about, and I'll gladly put down my dollar to ensure that more developers feel encouraged to do the same in the future. Nonetheless, the Jaguar is just one of over twenty five consoles I own. Neither Jaguar or Atari systems are my primary interest, so I don't even visit AtariAge often, and this website was barely on the radar previous to last week.

Because of that, I feel punished for not having a bigger interest in this console or that one, and lucky that I've managed to accrue some of the titles I have (like Mad Bodies). I'd never make a stink about it - after all, I'm lucky these titles are being released at all. Regardless, I know that there are others like me, and more yet that haven't discovered some of these consoles and the games released for them. I know they'll miss out on many more games then myself. I've even resorted to creating topics on more general forums so that people can inform each other when titles like this are released. Who knows how many people are aware of the 7200 or Colecovision modules, or Tempest coming to 5200, or Tiny Toons, or Recca for NES. I'm sure many people that would be interested surely have absolutely no idea, and will miss out entirely because of it.

Perhaps that's just the way it is, but if there's a solution to be had, I implore developers to consider it.

Posted by: Broonale Aug 6 2010, 04:57 PM

I followed the instructions here, even after the initial sellout, and mine is now in the mail.

It may have not been the smoothest release, but there were a few chances to order.

Thanks to all involved!

Posted by: JSII Admin Aug 6 2010, 08:38 PM

You'll love it Broonale, great release. Congrats to Team Jaguar. Too bad not enough to go around for everyone, but that's often the case. Maybe start a waiting list and if you get enough do an unnumbered release....

Posted by: viMaster Aug 7 2010, 01:29 AM

Wait, so instead of complaining, you followed the instructions laid out in the first post and you now have yours on the way...
Maybe others should have done the same instead of jumping to conclusions that all hope was lost. Afterall, they came out and said the first 75 had been sold out -- not that all 100 were gone.

Posted by: litoskin Aug 7 2010, 03:10 AM

i still don't know if my copies are reserved for me i have not received any reply at my order email.
please team jaguar let me know !

Posted by: hojbowski Aug 7 2010, 02:41 PM

Me too

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 7 2010, 02:51 PM

Can't reply too busy building the last 25 carts

Posted by: Sargon Aug 7 2010, 03:00 PM

For those of us who have paid for one of the initial 75 carts, have those orders shipped?

Posted by: evisu Aug 7 2010, 10:15 PM

I got a mail from PayPal, that my copy is on the way

Posted by: Sargon Aug 8 2010, 07:41 AM

Should I be concerned if I have not received that email? Anyone else?

Posted by: maxx11111 Aug 8 2010, 08:16 AM

i got a paypal mail saying shipped

Posted by: goatdan Aug 8 2010, 11:04 AM

I didn't jump to conclusions that all hope was lost. I actually *am* getting a copy. But, I still feel that my point stands.

If you want to keep the community the exact same, limited releases like this are an absolutely fine way to do it. If you want the community to grow and for more people to become aware of the new developments that are happening for it, then I definitely think that trying something like doing pre-orders over a period to mitigate risk for the person releasing it, as well as help to raise awareness of the projects during that time would be a better way to do it.

I guess I can be happy that in a year, I can probably sell my copy of Tiny Toons for $200, but I would rather feel more like I can get a chance to get these sorts of things. As I've said before and I'll say it again -- I will be happy to help people with doing these releases via pre-orders whether it is helping them to organize how to do it, or even helping to release something myself if need be. I've released five projects with pre-orders myself now, have suffered through and dealt with delays, and would be HAPPY to share my experiences with others if it means the community grows, instead of feeling personally put off that I don't have time to read the site every day and potentially missing stuff that has happened.

Is that so wrong?

Posted by: Team Jaguar Aug 8 2010, 02:01 PM

CONCERNING SHIPPING: WE SHIPPED OUT HALF OF THE ORDERS THIS WEEK, WE WILL HOPEFULLY BE ABLE TO SHIP OUT THE REST BY THE END OF NEXT WEEK.

Posted by: Broonale Aug 9 2010, 07:05 PM

Mine arrived today.

It all looks great! I will try it out Thurs.

The Jag stickers are always a nice touch!
I have quite a few now, but they are always cool to find in the box!

Posted by: litoskin Aug 10 2010, 03:59 AM

paypal invoice arrived and payment sent!
great!!!! now i'm waiting for the carts to arrive!!!!
thanks !

Posted by: DrMalba Aug 10 2010, 09:01 AM

Not that it matters since JagCF turned out to be oh-so-much-vaporware and needless squabbling thrown under the mat. But in hindsight, I thought it was pretty funny, how out of the dozens of folks here who spoke out against the ability for the proposed JagCF being able to run legacy Roms, not one breathed a whisper about this fact when Skunk came out. Did Madbodies actually employ any anti-skunk logic?

In any event, Skunk would have been only half as awesome as it is had it been crippled against older software ( though I still think you and Kskunk would have done OK for yourselves for at least one run).



There is no massive user base or reliable large group of nostalgia-minded folks like for C64, or 2600, or Dreamcast. There never will be. Its simple economics - you need folks who actually owned a Jag - and liked it. You're dealing with a manufactured base set of Jag units in the hundreds of thousands, versus some 10.6 million consoles sold for dreamcast, Even something as rare as the Sega CD sold something like 2.5 million units during its lifetime. Try navigating the perils of legacy console scenes like Virtual Boy, CD-i or Sega 32x and see how similar the scenarios for rare acquisitions or homebrew games and hardware actually are. Hell, i'd consider us pretty blessed there is still an active and vocal scene, even if it does tend towards crazy collector types ;-)

Posted by: megasdkirby Aug 10 2010, 02:45 PM

Got my copy yesterday.

WOW!!!!!

It's incredible! Something I would see as a Collector's Edition!

Quick note though...Tiny Toons has no sound, right?

Posted by: Tursi Aug 10 2010, 08:04 PM

I'm disappointed that you bring up this old argument yet again.



Yes. Quite a bit, actually. Have you seen it running on a Skunkboard?



My goal was neither a game-playing device nor profit. I worked with the community to provide what reassurances and outright protections were needed to gain the support of the people you are casting veiled insults after above. Note that I went to THEM, I didn't sit back and invite them to talk to me.

Blocking older software was discussed but I had little interest in the time it would take or the support issues it would cause. As for doing ok, I didn't go through all that hassle for profit (indeed, I lost $1000 in the first run). I saw a fantastic development tool for a machine that was difficult to do serious development on, and wanted other people to have it too.

Posted by: J-Man Aug 10 2010, 08:50 PM

Tursi, we are all grateful for the work you and kskunk did. You guys simply rock.

Posted by: ovalbugmann Aug 10 2010, 09:45 PM

Indeed it is a very nice accomplishment for developers as well as fans, Thank You Tursi and Kskunk for your work, time, financial support of the project and any PR troubles the release may have caused you or continue to cause you.


drmalba: Answers can usually always be had by using the search/view posts features of the board. You should know by now (three years here) that any negative JagCF or open "high seas" piracy comments probably won't be taken well. Do your research, it's all there.



True that J-man!

Posted by: Broonale Aug 10 2010, 09:47 PM

ditto

Posted by: DrMalba Aug 11 2010, 06:56 AM

Thanks ovalbugmann, i'm aware of both sides of the debate.



Eh, yeah, you're right, reading what I wrote again I was probably picking at a scab that should not be picked at. I don't have any issue with the way anyone runs their respective show. FWIW as I stated in my other post I supported those guys with their Madbodies release and I supported yours (both runs) and I just hope everyone keeps putting stuff out.

Posted by: Omf Aug 11 2010, 07:50 AM

for gods sake people! i am sick of this shit. why is it when something good comes about there is an impulsive urge to spew harsh words. yes the skunkboard exists yes it will play old games yes developers can write protection into new games. have we forgotten that protection was built into the skunkboard so BS / BSG wont run?

the flash cartridge can play old games too but no one bothers to mentions that!

seriously people be grateful with what actually exists unlike the up until this day vapoware JagCF cart

deal with it!

Posted by: LynxGod Aug 11 2010, 09:37 AM

Very well said OMf!!!!

Posted by: Alberto 2K Aug 11 2010, 09:48 AM

Ole Ole!!!! My copy arrived today at least!!

It´s a shame that Atari didn´t finished Tiny Toons, it could have been a great platformer game indeed.
I´m impatient to test the other betas in a Skunkboard!!

I´ve just received a brand new JaguarCD too so today it´s a really good day!

Thanks Team Jaguar and all the people involved in this release, now I´m waiting that Aircars KA sees the light of the day...

Posted by: JSII Admin Aug 12 2010, 05:31 PM

*2

Tursi is the man! If you're ever in Vegas you can find him hanging out at the Glacier Bar!

Posted by: Dan Iacovelli Aug 12 2010, 06:09 PM

I don't have a skunk so I can't load the roms to my jag(unless I can use bjl)
played tiny toons cart though cute game to bad the demo didn't have sound or music

Posted by: ovalbugmann Aug 12 2010, 07:48 PM

No sound or music, I take it? Ok then no biggie.

Posted by: Tursi Aug 15 2010, 04:36 AM

Unfortunately BJL won't run the demos, since they load into cart space.

Perhaps it's fair to close out the Skunk versus JagCF discussions with one thing that has NOT already been said to death (and this really has to be the closure, it's becoming ancient history.) Everything else has been said repeatedly.

As I noted, I specifically sought out the developers who I needed to work with. But in that I was using the mistakes of the JagCF crew to identify the problem areas, and try and find a compromise that would satisfy as many people as possible. It's safe to say that without that warning, the Skunk release would have been just as controversial. I was still pretty much a newb in the community -- if it backfired, my plan was to ship the run and leave, never looking back. For anyone who thinks it was easy to come to compromise, wishful thinking. I had to chase people, we went back and forth, and I had to write and test additional code -- not only what's in the BIOS, either. The evidence is that I was successful in my work, since besides the occasional grumble about what constitutes fair, it's been relatively quiet. And that's strikingly unusual in the Jaguar community.

Y'know, /I/ never said what titles were blocked, although BS was one safe bet. Someone has been very naughty. You guys have a commented disassembly of the BIOS yet? I'd love to see what you've got.

Posted by: Astropuff Aug 15 2010, 10:43 AM

I havent read all of this thread because I dont have any time right now. I was wondering if there is a video yet of tiny toons. If not could someone share one.
Thanks

Posted by: viMaster Aug 15 2010, 10:46 AM

Sorry, I was supposed to make one, but I got back from Vegas and had to work, so I haven't yet. I'll work on it.

Posted by: JSII Admin Aug 16 2010, 04:22 PM

Lazy ass!

Posted by: mawa Aug 22 2010, 09:02 AM

I'm still waiting form the item whas send to me on august 4

damn i want to play the game

Posted by: CD-i Aug 23 2010, 02:25 AM

I'm still waiting, too. Seems like the customs did get their hands on it...

Posted by: LynxGod Aug 23 2010, 03:53 AM

I got the customs card through the door on Saturday but its gonna have to wait a while for me to pick up.

Posted by: hojbowski Aug 25 2010, 02:02 PM

Got my #96 yesterday. Was lucky to pick up a game.

Posted by: evisu Aug 25 2010, 04:24 PM

Got my copy #64/100 yesterday. To all the publishers, producers and so on: Thank you very much for your time, energy and the ambition to share this beta´s with the community.

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 25 2010, 08:03 PM

So who got #100?? I pick mine up from the delivery office in about 4 hours!! Well I know I dont have #1

Posted by: evisu Aug 25 2010, 08:17 PM

And not #64 or #96. Your chances increase

Posted by: CD-i Aug 26 2010, 12:55 AM

got mine yesterday. #53. Thants to team Jaguar for finally get the opportunity to play tiny toons, although it's horribe crap imo :-D

Posted by: mawa Aug 26 2010, 02:01 AM

I still have a change to get number 100 beacouse i still not have recieve the game

Posted by: evisu Aug 26 2010, 06:22 AM

Just a question, whats special at #100? Cause it´s the "last" one?

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 26 2010, 09:23 AM

Just that its the last one, nothing else! Would be cool to have that one! However I got number 40 & a hole in the box cover (
As someone said earlier the game really isn't up to much!! I can see why Atari canned it, but its cool to see what they were doing, so thanks Team Jaguar

Posted by: LynxGod Aug 26 2010, 03:09 PM

Mine is still sitting in the post office until I have the money to pay for it so can't help yet.

Posted by: Team Jaguar Aug 26 2010, 04:02 PM

100 is the last CGE copy that we have to sell- I don't know if B&C plans to sell it through their site, he mentioned something about auctioning it to announce the next batch but we're not sure if we want to do that.

We will probably be checking to see if there is interest in another run sometime, but it seems our estimate for the initial batch was pretty accurate and lasted a little while. Once we get some more feedback we'll be better able to determine if there is still demand or if resales .etc will cover that.

We resolved all issues with paypal, who said that they do an initial check for large order volumes, but that our account is clear now and won't be subject to the same review procedures again.

For those who have not received your copy yet, it has only been about 14 days since we shipped out our last copy. Different countries treat shipments differently, they may be held up for a little while yet. People were still receiving Atomic nearly 3 months after originally shipped (ours should not since we shipped them differently), but it seems that alot of foreign buyers are receiving their beta packs already so hopefully everybody gets them soon!

Posted by: JSII Admin Aug 28 2010, 01:39 PM

Are you guys going to continue numbering them over 100 or is that first run the special and now they'll just be standard type releases? Interesting in what the plan is.

Posted by: bmX Aug 29 2010, 08:11 AM

Got mine the week before gamescom, too.

Posted by: Team Jaguar Aug 29 2010, 10:48 AM

if we do another print they will not have the CGE logo on them (unless it's at the CGE again, which is possible), probably will still be numbered. We have sold out and B&C only has about 2 left last I checked but there does not seem to be any immediate need for another print.

Glad alot of these are arriving overseas, and that they'll be making it to various events! Nice to hear that people like the packaging and design too.

The TTA gameplay is pretty average but we're happy to have been able to release the final build of a highly anticipated Jaguar title... now people can see just how far it got and find out for themselves what really happened to it. There are also some pretty interesting betas on the disc, we've already done the comparisons so nobody has to do too much work to see the differences.

Posted by: Gaztee Aug 29 2010, 10:52 AM

And why it got canned!!

Posted by: Willard Aug 29 2010, 11:01 AM

Twice

I think they could've turned it around and didn't really have to begin on the second version, but they would've needed to add much heavier tta themes, more detail in the art (like rayman) and the collectible icons could've been fully animated characters... a shame they were never really able to get a great tta game off the ground tho.

Posted by: mawa Sep 8 2010, 01:28 AM

Still not recieve it is already 5 till 6 weeks on his way to my house

cant wait anymoure to play it

Posted by: Willard Sep 8 2010, 03:16 PM

check ur pm... your box just arrived on my doorstep and the address on your paypal account was undeliverable.

Posted by: mawa Sep 8 2010, 11:54 PM

Have pm you back